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It is interesting to note that not a single catcher, (including Stock), or secondbaseman made the
top 30 list.
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1. Grant Green, SS, Chatham (Junior, Southern California)
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1 Kudos
2009 Draft: Scouting, News, Thoughts and Predictions
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 DoSomethingGood |
Cape Cod Baseball League's top 30 prospects | #81 | ||
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Posts: 71 12/24/08 3:21 PM |
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ziggyosk41 |
#82 | |||
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Veteran Member
Posts: 1723 12/24/08 4:31 PM |
I'd take a chance on Stock. As has been mentioned already, He has been extremely young for his competition, the upside is there, and we sure as hell need a
"Catcher of the Future". I'd role the dice.
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Curll84 |
#83 | |||
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Veteran Member
Posts: 262 12/24/08 4:48 PM |
It's not even rolling the dice. He'd likely be there in the 2nd or 3rd round, maybe he'll drop to the 5th round. We're not Anthony
Hewitt'ing this kid. He's got real baseball skills. Its not like the 2009 draft is super stocked.
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norbit14 |
#84 | |||
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Veteran Member
Posts: 2425 12/24/08 4:59 PM Veteran Member |
We should draft him but not in the first round. The first round picks are not just about the upside of the player but the overall package. If he has another
bad year he'll be there for us in the latter rounds, no need to over draft him. Also if he had such "baseball" skill maybe he'd have a good
season under his belt, don't tell me his age I know his age.
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hockeypuck2008 |
#85 | |||
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Veteran Member
Posts: 2029 12/24/08 6:05 PM Veteran Member |
norbit14 wrote: you remember Luis Soto? He had great baseball skills but he never put it together. Whether a player has a good season or not doesn't necessarily mean they have or have not good baseball skills. As for overall package, does Casey Kelly have that, or Ryan Dent? The draft isn't just about overall package but upside as well and I don't think anyone in this upcoming draft, which is being labeled worse than 2008 for overall talent (if that is possible), has the upside of Stock. Talent alone, Stock is a first rounder. Now when you add production than his draft stock (I hate to use that word considering the topic) begins to drop. Stock has the ability to become the best player in this draft and that is reason enough for me to say draft him with the first pick. Robert Stock is no more of a risk than anyone else outside of Strasburg.
Last Edited By: hockeypuck2008 12/24/08 6:17 PM.
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ziggyosk41 |
#86 | |||
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Veteran Member
Posts: 1726 12/24/08 6:21 PM |
hockeypuck2008 wrote:There is a difference between Skills and Tools. Tools imply potential with development needed. Skills are what Tools hopefully turn into. Skills are actual abilities that are present and working. Luis Soto never had alot of Skills, he had lots of tools though. I'm not sure about Stock, i've never seen him play, so I have no idea whether he is all potential, or he has actually put some of that potential to use. |
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norbit14 |
#87 | |||
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Veteran Member
Posts: 2426 12/24/08 6:25 PM Veteran Member |
I can guarantee you that he is not the second best player in the draft, even if it is on talent alone.
Last Edited By: norbit14 12/24/08 6:29 PM.
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Curll84 |
#88 | |||
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Veteran Member
Posts: 263 12/24/08 6:49 PM |
White, Green, and Tate are fighting over 2nd best player. But, they're pretty damn far off from Strasberg.
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norbit14 |
#89 | |||
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Veteran Member
Posts: 2427 12/24/08 7:28 PM Veteran Member |
And Stock is pretty far off does players you mention and a bunch of others.
Edit: I was referring to Stock.
Last Edited By: norbit14 12/24/08 7:50 PM.
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 TheGoldenGreek33 |
#90 | |||
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Veteran Member
Posts: 2025 12/24/08 7:33 PM Veteran Member |
Strasburg is a UCL tear waiting to happen. It's really just a matter of time.
"Dustin Pedroia doesn't have the strength or bat speed to hit major-league pitching consistently, and he has no power." - KLaw
"Here's an example of weird: The Atlanta Braves asked Hissey if he was afraid of animals in cages." "I've talked to a lot of scouts about Strasburg, and no one has brought up mechanical concerns." - Callis
Last Edited By: TheGoldenGreek33 05/27/09 2:03 AM.
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Duffman545 |
#91 | |||
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Veteran Member
Posts: 1021 12/24/08 7:49 PM |
TheGoldenGreek33 wrote: Beat me to it, Strausberg's mechanics need major work. His delivery is full of red flags. The talent is there, yeah, but if I were to be the team taking him I'd consider completely reworking his delivery. However, it's tough to do that with a guy who supposedly should go #1 overall. |
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templeUsox |
#92 | |||
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Posts: 12703 12/24/08 7:51 PM
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He's worth the risk without changing a thing he does. I never really bought into the whole "so and so is a lock to have an injury" thing anyway.
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Duffman545 |
#93 | |||
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Veteran Member
Posts: 1022 12/24/08 8:06 PM |
templeUsox wrote: A lock? No. But when I evaluate talent, injury risk is high on my list of importance, especially with pitchers and elbows/shoulders. I don't know about you. |
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templeUsox |
#94 | |||
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Posts: 12704 12/24/08 8:23 PM
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I think trying to analyze a pitcher's injury risk based on his delivery is a fool's errand. Some pitchers are able to thrive in an unconventional
motion, while others will wilt with "picture perfect" deliveries. It's important to take injury risk into account when analyzing a pitcher. So
out of that piece of pie which injury risk represents in the overall analysis, 60% is their usage history, 35% is their injury history, and 5% is their motion.
Right now, there is very little evidence that Strasburg is an injury risk and certainly not enough to remove him from the clear 1/1 favorite for next
year's draft.
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Curll84 |
#95 | |||
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Veteran Member
Posts: 264 12/24/08 8:36 PM |
Lincecum was an injury waiting to happen. So was Pedro. So is Bowden. Okajima, too. And Foulke. And many others.
Mark Prior was to never, ever have a single issue because his mechanics were flawless. It is a bunch of bullshit. The ones I listed above might have gotten hurt, but it wasn't until they were at an age where injury is very common. If the organization takes care of them, they should be fine. So, don't hire Dusty Baker and your pitchers won't get hurt. |
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hockeypuck2008 |
#96 | |||
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Veteran Member
Posts: 2031 12/24/08 11:59 PM Veteran Member |
ziggyosk41 wrote: you are absolutely right Ziggy. Stock has the tools but that is a good thing. Sure the production hasn't been there but I believe that is inevitable. Norbit, I disagree with you but that is cool. Happy Holidays to you guys. |
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TheGoldenGreek33 |
#97 | |||
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Veteran Member
Posts: 2027 12/25/08 5:04 AM Veteran Member |
templeUsox wrote:Clearly, with your recent infatuation with Gerrit Cole. I'm not implying that Strasberg would, without a doubt, suffer an injury because of his mechanics. I was insinuating the fact that there is a much greater chance of injury for him having a large frame, throwing a slider, and in turn having terrible mechanics. Rarely will you see guys that have the durability to pitch despite an unorthodox delivery (Johan). I don't think you can argue the fact that pitchers with smooth mechanics are in a tremendous advantage health-wise than those with violent motions. With that said, I just don't agree with your pie chart at all. Both usage and injury history are directly intertwined and due largely in part by how strong their mechanics are. Being as big of the Sabathia advocate you were this off-season, I'm quite shocked when you say 60% of a pitchers overall analysis is usage history. Without a doubt, CC has his mechanics to thank for his durability. As do a lot of other pitchers who had solid mechanics that didn't have the best frames (Schilling, Wells, Livan Hernandez). Besides Koufax, name one pitcher who has largely solid mechanics that experienced arm problems? Usage History: What's the main reason a pitcher is able to throw a lot of innings? Did you dismiss CC because he has a lot of miles on his arm? No. And why is that? That's right. Injury History: Again, what's the main reason a pitcher has problems staying healthy? Why were so many people against signing Burnett long-term this offseason? Do you think it has anything to do with the fact he can't stay healthy because his mechanics are an absolute mess? Mechanics: A pitchers usage and injury history are dependent on whether or not they have good mechanics. It is downright laughable to say that 5% of a pitchers analysis should be on their motion.
"Dustin Pedroia doesn't have the strength or bat speed to hit major-league pitching consistently, and
he has no power." - KLaw
Laporta/Alvarez/Meyer |
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TheGoldenGreek33 |
#98 | |||
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Veteran Member
Posts: 2028 12/25/08 5:11 AM Veteran Member |
Curll84 wrote:Lincecum is 23, Pedro was a freak of nature (that eventually got hurt), Bowden is 21, and Okajima and Foulke are relievers. They throw 20 pitches an outing two, maybe three times a week. Relievers don't rely on durability like starters who throw three times the amount of innings they do. Prior always had horrible mechanics. ESPN was the only one praising them. Ask any mechanic guru and they said the same thing back then.
"Dustin Pedroia doesn't have the strength or bat speed to hit major-league pitching consistently, and
he has no power." - KLaw
Laporta/Alvarez/Meyer |
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templeUsox |
#99 | |||
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Posts: 12705 12/25/08 12:51 PM
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GG, no offense, but what the hell are you talking about?
Of course everything is directly intertwined. That's a given. But if a pitcher with what you would term "improper mechanics" has no history of injury and has no history of being abused, then of course he is going to be considered less of an injury risk than a pitcher with good mechanics who has been injured in the past or has been taxed. The Sox sent Caleb Clay to Birmingham, AL to get his delivery analyzed via computer the winter after he was drafted. The readouts determined that he had a sound delivery. One year later, he needed TJ surgery. Why? Because pitching is a violent motion, if you have a picture perfect delivery or a messy delivery. So, yes, pitchers with crappy deliveries and perfect deliveries will get injured every year. That doesn't mean you can only point to the ones with crappy deliveries and say "I told you so". It's much more accurate to look at usage and injury history than to pay attention to an armchair mechanics analyst. Do you really think Strasburg will get hurt? Would you even put $20 on that if I gave you odds? All these years that I've been paying attention to the draft I've heard that so-and-so is an injury waiting to happen and I've seen that that really has no predictive value whatsoever. |
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ArodSucksAtLife |
#100 | |||
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Veteran Member
Posts: 2972 12/25/08 7:09 PM Veteran Member |
this post was stupid and full of drunkisms so i reased it - BSCrich |
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