Re: Hagadone - TJ Surgery?

feeds@yuku.com (RedSoxAnni) — Wed, 30 Apr 2008 08:50:54 GMT

I posted this story in the news link thread yesterday; Alex Speier from the Union Leader had it before the Globe

Sox Beat: Prize Sox prospect faces surgery

Left-hander Nick Hagadone, who was taken in the second round with the team's top selection in last year's draft,...

Re: Hagadone - TJ Surgery?

feeds@yuku.com (Cem21) — Wed, 30 Apr 2008 07:40:15 GMT

From Today's Sox Notebook in the Boston Globe.

Nick Hagadone, the Red Sox' No. 1 pick in the 2007 draft, was supposed to meet with Dr. James Andrews, but the visit has been delayed. Hagadone is seeking a second opinion after he tore an ulnar collateral ligament, which normally would mean Tommy John surgery. An infection in his leg, however, has put the examination on hold, since Hagadone can't travel at the moment

Re: Hagadone - TJ Surgery?

feeds@yuku.com (Titans Bastard) — Sat, 26 Apr 2008 02:43:37 GMT

I think there's a little more doom & gloom than is necessary. Recovery times for TJ surgery vary from player to player but if he goes under the knife now, there is a decent chance he'll get a good half a season of experience in 2009. It will certainly put him behind schedule, but it's not the death knell of his career. Also keep in mind that the Rule 5 Draft rules have changed and all players now have an extra year of minor league experience before than become eligible and...

Re: Hagadone - TJ Surgery?

feeds@yuku.com (Quintanariffic) — Fri, 25 Apr 2008 13:47:02 GMT

mitchkupcheck wrote:

Quintanariffic wrote:

we finally put to bed the notion that TJ surgery improves arm strength? That's nonsense. It's the rehab program that you are put on (and which could have been followed prior to the injury regardless) which strengthens the arm, not the surgery itself.

Good point... however, the fact...

Re: Hagadone - TJ Surgery?

feeds@yuku.com (mitchkupcheck) — Fri, 25 Apr 2008 13:17:40 GMT

Quintanariffic wrote:

we finally put to bed the notion that TJ surgery improves arm strength? That's nonsense. It's the rehab program that you are put on (and which could have been followed prior to the injury regardless) which strengthens the arm, not the surgery itself.

Good point... however, the fact that you have a new transplanted ligament helps. Obviously, if you just have the surgery...

Re: Hagadone - TJ Surgery?

feeds@yuku.com (SoxScout) — Fri, 25 Apr 2008 12:34:46 GMT

Nick Hagadone, the left-hander chosen first by the Sox in last June's draft, is facing Tommy John elbow reconstruction surgery, according to Soxprospects.com, but club officials say that they are awaiting a second opinion from noted orthopedist James Andrews, whom Hagadone is scheduled to see Saturday. Hagadone, who was taken 55th overall last June, had extended his consecutive scoreless innings streak to 33 with 2 1/3 scoreless...

Re: Hagadone - TJ Surgery?

feeds@yuku.com (hockeypuck2008) — Fri, 25 Apr 2008 11:00:09 GMT

damn....this blows.

Re: Hagadone - TJ Surgery?

feeds@yuku.com (Quintanariffic) — Fri, 25 Apr 2008 10:22:52 GMT

Great point re: the 40 man roster implications. As a college draftee, he's going to run into this issue a year sooner than Delcarmen did.

Re: Hagadone - TJ Surgery?

feeds@yuku.com (jspearlj1) — Fri, 25 Apr 2008 10:16:58 GMT

The other thing to consider is that it means he has to be on the 40 man with less development time on him, which, like Quintanariffic said, is more likely to force him into relief than starting. It's not a set in stone thing, but Hagadone will probably not be starting much next year even when he comes back to help preserve his arm, so you're talking about one year of starting before he has to get on the 40 man. Sure that still gives him 4 years of learning how to be a starter, but...

Re: Hagadone - TJ Surgery?

feeds@yuku.com (Quintanariffic) — Fri, 25 Apr 2008 10:08:01 GMT

This is great inside scoop. A real shame for Hagadone. Philly Sox Fan had a great post on this over at SoSH, looking at the "80% success rate" with a more critical eye. Let's be clear here - even with an 80% success rate, there's a 20% chance he never makes it back. And then what constitutes "success"? For a major league pitcher, that's easy enough to measure b/c you have an established baseline to evaluate. For a minor leaguer, it's very...

Re: Hagadone - TJ Surgery?

feeds@yuku.com (jspearlj1) — Fri, 25 Apr 2008 09:24:24 GMT

Thanks for the inside info mitch. I hope he carries the no bad feelings about the delivery change towards the sox even after this injury. It's a shame a special arm like this will be shut down for awhile.

Re: Hagadone - TJ Surgery?

feeds@yuku.com (raftsox) — Fri, 25 Apr 2008 09:12:13 GMT

balls. two of my three favorite low level pitching prospects down for the season. i will refrain from mentioning the other in utter terror.
on a good note, at least we know that nick will return healthy at some point. his problem will be not fearing to throw his slider which seems to happen to a lot of guys after tj. bailey's injury is the one that really hurts; does anyone know the extent of the tear?

Re: Hagadone - TJ Surgery?

feeds@yuku.com (mitchkupcheck) — Fri, 25 Apr 2008 02:31:45 GMT

Those were Nick's words... I don't have alot of insight into how his new versions mechanics have affected his arm, and this injury. From everything I know about UCL damage, it really weakens over time. I will say from my own experience, that sometimes working on a new pitch disrupts timing... that disruption can lead to added stress on one part of the body. I'm sure there is alot of pressure on the arm of a 6'5" 230 kid falling down a hill.

As far as his...

Re: Hagadone - TJ Surgery?

feeds@yuku.com (templeUsox) — Thu, 24 Apr 2008 19:50:04 GMT

Dustin McGowan has TJ surgery.

Re: Hagadone - TJ Surgery?

feeds@yuku.com (LeftyTG) — Thu, 24 Apr 2008 17:29:47 GMT

AMarshal2 wrote:

And any labrum tear seems like the kiss of death to me. What prospect has suffered a labrum tear and made it as a successful MLB pitcher? Look what it did to Pedro's career.

Curt Schilling is the only pitcher I can think of who came back from a labrum tear and had any kind of sustained success. If memory serves, he tore his labrum with the Phillies in '95, so he wasn't...

Re: Hagadone - TJ Surgery?

feeds@yuku.com (TheGoldenGreek33) — Thu, 24 Apr 2008 17:10:20 GMT

I believe this is the article you read, jspearl.

If there's a question about Hagadone, it's his delivery. Washington coaches eschew the traditional teachings of balance point and staying back in favor of being quick to the plate. While Hagadone's arm action is fairly long and fluid, the rest of his delivery will likely need to be lengthened.

link...

Re: Hagadone - TJ Surgery?

feeds@yuku.com (jspearlj1) — Thu, 24 Apr 2008 17:01:20 GMT

I doubt that's what did it really, but I believe his delivery was a bit max effort so if he was going to be a starter then better to do it sooner rather than later.

Re: Hagadone - TJ Surgery?

feeds@yuku.com (SoxScout) — Thu, 24 Apr 2008 16:43:14 GMT

Disappointing that we decided to even change his delivery in the first place.

Re: Hagadone - TJ Surgery?

feeds@yuku.com (Steve Dillard) — Thu, 24 Apr 2008 16:34:30 GMT

By the way, Greg Kite dominated Kupchak in the playoffs.

Re: Hagadone - TJ Surgery?

feeds@yuku.com (jsinger121) — Thu, 24 Apr 2008 16:12:02 GMT

Welcome to Soxprospects.com Mitchkupcheck. Thank you for the info.

Hagadone - TJ Surgery?

feeds@yuku.com (soxprospects) — Thu, 24 Apr 2008 08:19:00 GMT

This is NOT conirmed, but I've heard two rumors from people claiming to be in the know that Nick Hagadone will have Tommy John Surgery this week. If so, thats terrible news. On the positive side, at least he'd be ready to go next year around his time, and would only substantively miss this season.

EDIT: Confirmed - Hagadone to have TJS on Tuesday.